The God Debate! (Strap on your seat belt)

This post is not about right or wrong. I have no allegiance to either side. This post is about how the “Atheist vs Theist” debate is pointless.

eddiestarofficial

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Humanity 2.0- Escape the noise

Does God exist? And if he or she does exist, which God is it. Are you a Christian? Catholic? What denomination? Do you believe in another religion? Buddhist, Muslim, Judaism. What is your belief? Or maybe you are an Atheist.

This is a long debate that has been going on for centuries. I just so happen to be Agnostic. Agnostic, is another way of saying “I don’t know”. Bill Maher once quipped that Agnostics are Atheists without balls, or something like that. Lmao. It is somewhat true. I just am being completely honest. Richard Dawkins, author of The Selfish Gene,  publicly mocks religion, using science and evolution as proof. And the Christians have Professor John Lennox, author of Gunning for God, who uses the limited ability of science to contest skeptics.

Here is a clip of the debate:

This post is not about right or wrong. I have no allegiance to either side. This post is about how the “Atheist vs Theist” debate is pointless.

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Let’s start off with the Christian argument, because I live in America, which is a Christian nation. Christianity, a belief that stems from the collective books of witnesses of Jesus Christ. Combined, they form the Bible. The Bible is the truth to the Christian follower because God is Jesus Christ. There is no other God. The Bible is living proof of their belief.

If I am a Christian and I follow the Bible – word for word- I will be rewarded in the afterlife to a place called Heaven. Where me and my Father, Jesus Christ, will meet in spirit and spend the rest of my eternal life. Heaven is a place with many amenities and rewards for followers who have lived by the word of the Bible. If you are a non-believer, you will be sent to the abysmal pits of hell. You will be banished to Hell, where you will meet Satan and be tortured by demons and burned by the hottest fire you could imagine. This is a real belief that I stand behind, and if you don’t have that belief , than I honestly feel sorry for you. God is giving you the opportunity to change your life and become one with the creator. He can make a difference in your life. I am living proof, he has forgiven me for my sins and can do the same for you. When I approach you about Christ, I am sincerely wanting to save you from the wrath. Christ is coming back, and he is taking only those who have accepted him as their Lord and Savior. Sinners will be left behind with a stamp of the mark of the beasts. 666 will be branded on the guilty sinners forehead , and the world will be a dystopian, chaotic slum. If I die, and I am wrong, what do I have to lose? I will be rewarded with heaven. Science is limited and can’t tell me about what passion I feel for my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

Now lets go on to the Atheist non-believer who is seen as a Satan worshipper in the Christians view. In America, this is a strong debate; Christians rarely argue with other religions, because Atheists are seen as the Christian’s true enemy. It could possibly be due to the fact that many skeptics don’t live by a moral code. Some do have moral codes, it is impossible to calculate because Atheism is autonomous.

If I am an Atheist and I am disrespected at the mention of Christ, this would be my argument. Religion is a mental disease. Any person with a rational mind knows that there is no God. God is a concept, so Christians are simply worshipping a concept in their brain. Where was God when (insert American tragedy) happened?..Where is the proof of God? Christians have no right to disrespect homosexuals and tell me that I can’t have an abortion. America is supposed to be built on freedom. Ok, so you want me believe a snake convinced two naked people to eat an apple that caused a lifelong curse? That makes as much sense as Harry Potter. Some of the Pastors are the biggest crooks in the world. If you want to be an Atheist, read the Bible.  So Jesus supported slavery and murdered children, and I am wrong because I want to have sex with a woman I’m not married to. How about when we die, nothing happens. I have read the God delusion by Dawkins, and I know that there is no God. It is scientifically proven. Science is proving that we actually evolved from a species in the ocean, and evolved into upright mammals. Where is the literature about dinosaurs and things that existed before Christ? Homosexuality is supposed to be a sin, when Slavery isn’t. The Bible contradicts itself several times over.

God condoning slavery:

 If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years.  Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom.  If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year.  But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him.  If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master.  But the slave may plainly declare, ‘I love my master, my wife, and my children.  I would rather not go free.’  If he does this, his master must present him before God.  Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl.  After that, the slave will belong to his master forever.  (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)

God killing babies:

Exodus 12:29New International Version (NIV)

29 At midnight the Lord struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well.

So this argument goes back and forth all night, almost to the point of becoming physical. It is an argument that will never stop happening, because people want to prove that they are right.  Here is the truth about this issue. It doesn’t matter. Here is why:

As a country, we are becoming so imbued with trying to be righteous martyrs for our beliefs, and non-belief, that we are forgetting the importance of humanity. I am personally Agnostic and have no idea how the world began. I believe the majority of us don’t know either. I cannot say that I believe that the world was created by a Big-Bang Theory. I don’t believe that man and woman were just magically dropped off on Earth. The world is a complex place to live in, for that reason we all have our own truths. There is the explainable, and the unexplainable. If you get in a car accident and fly out the windshield and land on a tree branch with only a chipped tooth as your injury, who am I to say it wasn’t God who saved you? It may have been extreme luck, or a supreme spiritual unseen deity that saved you. If you were an abusive alcoholic and shot heroin in your veins, went to church and had an epiphany, how can I tell you religion is bad? I honestly don’t know. I steer away from religion because it is too rigid and often encourages unrealistic discipline – The appearance of being Holier that Thou and pious – What do you mean by that? It is when you are forced to look down when an attractive woman is in your presence, because lustful thoughts are offensive to the Lord. I am a mammal and sexual by nature. I cannot help if I am attracted to a woman while having a general conversation. I am a sexual creature. I inherently know I am wrong to publicly objectify her with cat calls, whistles, or bawdy stares, but thinking these thoughts are innocuous. Or how I am supposed to dislike a homosexual male or female because of their sexual desires? How does that affect my daily life routine? Homosexuality is not a contagious airborne disease. It is not something that should be feared. I don’t agree with the Bible’s point of view, and in order to be a true believer of Christ, which means following the Bible, I would have to carry on those beliefs. You have some Christians who ride the fence, and treat the Bible like a delicatessen. These are the folks who pick and choose what part of the Bible they live by, instead of the actual word of the Bible. Some true Christians call these types “Part-time Christians”.

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I don’t wish to be lumped in with radical Atheism either. I don’t think it’s hilarious to imperiously mock a person for what they believe in. I laugh at a few Bill Maher jokes, but I refuse to be the guy with the Atheist bumper stickers on my car, wearing an Atheist shirt that disrespects a man’s belief. I totally understand this mode of thinking:

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“I am different, look at me. I read a few books and blogs online. I don’t listen to my grandparent’s and I can finally be me. Religion is boring and I hated church also! Gimme a high 5 bro!”

Being an irrational asshole, and disrespecting people publicly makes you as crazy as the guy who is a Tea-Party radical Christian picketing in front of an abortion clinic. We have been so entrenched in this debate, that we have forgotten about humanity. We have been focused too long on BEING correct, and BEING right, that we aren’t collectively GETTING it right. A deadly disease will be just as harmful to a Christian, as it would be to an Atheist or any religion. We have to escape the noise and become advocates for humanity. Be kind to one another in passing, accepting differences that we aren’t accustomed to seeing. I know that we will never live in some utopian fantasy world where we all hold hands and sing kumbaya. Religion and non-religion are both part of life. Racism and bigotry will stand, and wars will continue on. This blog will be another compelling read that floats in cyberspace. I just want to challenge your biases and beliefs. This is meant for you to re-examine how ridiculous we can look, when you realize Earth is a small part of a infinite universe with planets and galaxies that are undiscovered. We are small in comparison to the Universe. Our Sun is a dot compared to “Canis Majoris”, a huge sphere of fire that makes the sun look like a grain of sugar.

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Humans could be far more insignificant than we purport to be. We are intelligent creatures, so smart that we have captured the knowledge of other worlds and galaxies. However, I believe that the pursuit of other lifeforms, is more important than an argument between two people who don’t agree on religion. Finally, my last question is. In the MACRO lens, What if human life doesn’t have a purpose, only to exist and re-produce more life?

Thanks for taking the time out to read this long blog. Hopefully you feel compelled to like, share, or comment.

Twitter:@eddiestarblog

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44 thoughts on “The God Debate! (Strap on your seat belt)”

  1. I was baptized Chritian-Ortodox. I believe in God, but in God as being this good hearted Father that accepts us all exactly how we are. He doesn’t get involved in our lives unless we really ask him from the bottom of our hearts. Sometimes even then he doesn’t but it’s because he knows better, he knows what is to come and he knows if he changes things nothing will be the same anymore. I don’t believe in God’s punishment not in this life or the other, as I believe that somehow by our own choices in life we manage to punish ourselves and well if we don’t if there is God there is the devil as well. It doesn’t make sense does it? All this to say that I don’t know where I stand as a believer but I know I don’t believe in religion. I don’t believe in the Church and I don’t believe a word of what the bible says. Maybe I’m a sinner for it but only God can actually know. So here it is! I understand people might not agree with me and it’s ok. I don’t stand for fights when it comes to this because it is to each of us to decide what we believe or don’t.

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      1. You are very welcome! It is a touchy subject. Many people get offended by it, personally I will never understand why but well…people are people. ☺️

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  2. Looking at the benefit to harm ratio when it comes to religion, I’d say it causes much more harm. I see that it tries to do good things, and sometimes it does; but more often than not, religion is responsible for a lot of the bad things. Religion has become more about politics and money than about anything else.

    As an atheist, the only purpose I have found in life is to try to be good to other people. Unfortunately, I don’t always succeed, but that doesn’t keep me from trying. If there is a reason or purpose for suffering, I don’t know what it could be — except that it’s just part of being human.

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    1. I do myself agree with your views as an agnostic, leaning towards atheism like Dawkins. I think the worry deeply religious people have is that, if you don’t have a supernatural power and if there is not imposed view on morality, what then prevents you to become a monster? And the answer to that may be a difficult one. But I think that’s not a good question to ask in a ever evolved society we live in.

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      2. War mongering has so many causes behind it. Religion is not always the main cause but can and did play pivotal role majority of the times in history. Religion caused a lot of suffering, even causing now. But I just don’t completely agree that religion did it all wrong. How I view religion is that religion sometimes was good human attempt to make society better and bring connection towards something invisible and also with visible fellow human being. But because religion is man made, therefore based on lots of misconceptions and fallacies and lots of the time driven by greedy power mongering people. Therefore, I think we are better off reforming our views of human welfare, can take suggestions from religion, but not entirely base on some specific values. And it is difficult to achieve that and will take thousands of years. But I am optimistic that we are walking towards the right direction with obstacles every now and then.

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  3. This is a very fascinating topic of discussion that I love to bring up on different occasions in a naive hope that some general conclusion materializes.

    I am a sincere and level-headed believer of that we should question everything that we can. If I have a theory, you are more than welcome to try to prove me wrong. Much like science works. Anybody, anywhere, at anytime can dedicate their lives to try to prove any scientific theory wrong, and, if right, science will stand corrected an applaud you. Science encourages change. Welcomes it.

    The same cannot be said of religion. It doesn’t welcome change, it doesn’t want to be questioned. It demand it should be believed, and if not, you can (and will) go to hell.

    All religions say “this is the right one”, but how can that be true if we have tens of thousands of different ones? Also, if I’m born in Rome, I’m WAY more likelier to be a catholic than a muslim. If I’m born and raised in Saudi Arabia, much likelier that I’ll grow up to be a muslim than a Jew.

    Exceptions exist of course, but you catch my drift.

    Point is, I refuse to believe in something that I cannot question, cannot compare, and cannot try to prove wrong.

    It is very much possible that “a God” created the universe and everything in it, but certainly not a God based on a book written a petty two thousand years ago, which is a silly-small time compared to almost 14 BILLION years. By that logic, religion is out, but “a God” is up for discussion.

    Do the religious scriptures even adress the fact that it’s clearly evident that our Earth has existed for many billion years? Fossils? Lightyears? Stars? Different galaxies? Where do these things fit in the holy scriptures?

    Man, if I go on a lot more I’ll start to make zero sense – if I even make sense NOW – and talk to myself. Rant is now over.

    Awesome blog and awesome topic. Keep it up!

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  4. I agree with you that the debate is pointless, atheism and religion are often things people come to or leave of their own accord due to their own events, deep person changes, and I’d prefer them to be quietly personal. However, all the while there’s Texan politicians trying to get creationism rather than evolution taught in schools, and other areas where church and state are blurring, I can see why atheists/agnostics want to wave signs.

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  7. Personally, I feel only mankind itself could be vain enough to believe that it was created by some kind of supreme being, and then decietful enough to use that belief to control others.

    I’m NOT saying there is no god, in fact I see god in everything, in the compassion and understanding of others, in the beauty of nature and art, even in science and philosophy.

    – Truth be told the only place I don’t see god is in religion.

    Great post, as always.

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  8. ” become advocates for humanity. Be kind to one another in passing, accepting differences that we aren’t accustomed to seeing. ”

    True, and thank you for having the guts to post this.
    ShiraDest.
    2 November, 12015 HE (Holocene/Human Era … the Holocene Calendar)

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  10. As a Christian, I must say that this is very well-written. So often the debate between believers and non-believers becomes loud and shrill and devoid of meaning from both sides.
    Have you heard of Pascal’s Gamble? It goes something like this: If I believe in God and I am wrong, there are no bad consequences. If I say there is no God and I am wrong, there are enormous consequences. So it’s safer to believe than not to believe.
    I don’t think believing is a rational decision. Nor do I think it’s irrational; I think it exists outside of reason and logic. True love and a sense of what is beautiful are two other things that cannot be reduced to reason and logic. Kierkegaard spoke of faith as a leap into the unknown. Having made that leap, I am quite satisfied with where I have landed.
    Anyhow, thank you for contributing so well to the conversation. J.

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  11. A debate based on scientific inquiry would most certainly be a more productive argument than a debate on religion. It’s the reason why I”ll never have the audacity to cover issues of religion as a journalist

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  12. Interesting post, presented rationally and respectfully. I am Christian but I am also capable of independent thought. In my view, science and religion are not diametrically opposed and arguments pitting one against the other usually serve little purpose beyond upsetting those on the other side of the argument. I feel that science should be in the schools and creationism should be left in the churches. If there are occasions when the two overlap and agree, so much the better. The universe just happened all by itself? Maybe, but I’m a little doubtful about that. Conversely, literal interpretation of the Bible can, at times, be the height of human arrogance. World created in six days? Maybe, but I don’t think those days consisted of a mere 24 hours. And why should we assume they did? Who are we to define the length of God’s day?
    To my mind, applying logic to such matters does not define me as a part-time Christian (or, as the other saying goes, a cafeteria Catholic) but rather as a rational being. Others may find their mileage varies. I will happily accept the tag “humanist Christian”. Personally, I have no problem with atheists as long as they don’t try to convert me, and I do not attempt to inflict my beliefs on them. The same applies to those who hold other beliefs. The majority of my friends are Pagans; I respect their practices and they respect mine. That is the element that is so sadly lacking in many discussions of religion – respect. Too many people, xenophobic in the extreme, are not interested in the exchange of ideas or rational discussion but only in attacking those who do not share their own views. On the other hand, a friend of mine, when asked if she believes in God, replies quite seriously, “Yes. I believe in all of them.”

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  13. I understand where you are coming from. While I do not wish to bash Christianity, as many of my relatives are Christians, there are many reasons I do not stick to that belief system. I myself am Jewish, and I see many holes in the Christian system. Not only are many of them “part time”, but they do not even fully recognize the first half of their scriptures. Judaism is not a proselytizing religion, so I am not here to tell you that it is how you should believe. However, I am saying that you should look into one of the most consistent belief systems to ever exist. It can’t be compared to Christianity, because the Christians basically say “Yeah dude! God id the same yesterday, today, and forever! But we don’t have to follow the rules. Jesus changed all that, and Jesus is God.” Solid logic, eh? There is a reason so many people find Christianity to be very hypocritical! I must say though, I LOVE your writing style! Great job.

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  14. I think the best thing we can do as human beings is respect the rights of others to hold the beliefs that they want. If I believe in anything, I believe in tolerance. Thank you for your interesting perspective on this challenging and fascinating question.

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  15. Eddie, I appreciate your thoughts and your desire to be open to the truth, wherever that leads. However, I’d like to push back a bit on a few of your points.

    First, you begin by declaring that you wish not to declare allegiance to either side of the debate and to remain unbiased, but then offer several example arguments against the Bible and Christianity, while offering no such arguments from the other side. In doing so, I was given the impression that while you believe no one can know the truth, at least the atheist/agnostic position isn’t as ugly and untrue as the theist’s.

    Secondly, I appreciate your disdain for “part-time Christians” (which I share), but am confused as to whether or not you believe a “full-time” Christian would instead embrace relativistic truth, affirming all peoples of all lifestyles and holding no claim to absolute truth.

    Thanks for your thoughts in this post. I deeply appreciate this kind of dialogue and look forward to your response!

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    1. Thanks Aaron. I appreciate your candor. For the first point, I did feel I may have came off as athiest friendly. I could have brought up an example of how easily one could deduce that religion in general is necessary for means of structure. If you have a town with no leaders, government, or military, one could easily assume that the town would be in shambles. Chaos and tyranny would be rampant. Religion from this vantage point could be viewed as an arbiter. That is something I should have added. The problem with atheism is that there is no guideline or structure for the entire group. I cannot point to a book that outlines the code of conduct for athiests. If I were to say that an athiest dominant society would equal terror, that would be pure speculation. No solid evidence other than conjecture. Secondly, a full time Christian could be friendly to all walks of life. Just not completely accepting of homosexuality and abortions. Your beliefs would cause conflict whenever politics are brought up, because the laws you vote for would be pro Christian. So yes, you could appear to be more accepting, but never to the point of pure acceptance and understanding. Just my opinion.

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  16. I believe God exists if you believe He does. I do know there are truths in life and death that no one can debate away. I believe that Jesus truly is the Son of God and that He was born and died for a reason. I am not religious, but follow the words of Christ in loving God and one another.

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  17. Great am inspiring post! I am also inclined to question about Christianity’s version of God. I consider myself a skeptic. I have also been inclined to believe that this existence is for me to develop my own purpose in this life.

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